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What are some preferred places to live south of Lisbon over the bridge(s)

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(@ianmcshane)
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Hi,

I am moving over to Portugal next month and am going to be staying in Almada for the first three months.

So far I have, on previous trips, explored Lisbon all the way to Cascais. I do like that strip but I do want to investigate the area south of Lisbon over the bridge from Almada to Setúbal and a little east of that area.

The plan is to rent a home (house T3+ with a garden, with reliable internet connection for work) in October but leading up to that, explore the area to get a better feel.  Initially I won't have a car and will be leveraging Uber, bus and train a lot.

Does anyone know the region that I am referring to at all? Any advice on areas that I should focus on?

 

Thank you very much,

Ian

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(@jonesdn2020)
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Ian, we are looking to scout that area as well. Costa de Caparica and the surrounding area is our focus for now. The area was recommended to us by a local.

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(@ianmcshane)
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Thank you for the info! Do let me know what you find out... as I learn things I can post the details here.

Oh and good luck! 😀

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(@andrew_za)
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@ianmcshane We have stayed in Barreiro for almost a year now. It being the first and only place we have had a permanent rental since arriving.

The pros:
- Cheaper rentals (a nice spacious and furnished T2 is around 700 - T3 from around 800/850 - depending on whether you are laid back and don't mind dated aesthetics or want new and flashy), much cheaper than Lisbon and slightly cheaper than Almada / Montijo. Many locals I have spoken to chose to buy apartments here and then catch the ferry (20 minutes) to Terreiro do Paco (Ferry station at the bottom of the Lisbon hill).
- For long term rental apartment investments between 100k and 200k - this is area has excellent potential.
- Good medical amenities / options - mainly private - the public health centres are OK - you will get helped but may have to wait a few hours - this seems to be usual in most places.
- Small mall - lots of small shops / restaurant options / bakeries etc. There is a large Continente, 2 or 3 Lidls and an Aldi or two. 
- Nice parks and walkway / green areas next to the Estuary. The outdoor areas have improved since we have gotten here.
- The Ferry has been a lifesaver to connect us with Lisbon without a car - so this is a big bonus. Once you arrive in Lisbon, you can take the metro to get anywhere - the metro card is 40 euro p/m including all transport in the greater Lisbon / Setubal area, and it includes the bus and ferry in Barreiro. If you wanted to go to Porto for example you would do Ferry <-> Lisbon Metro <-> Lisbon Oriente <-> Porto Campanha - in half a day.
- We did our SEF appointment and IMT drivers exchange in Setubal which had less waiting times and shorter arrival times for our cards (much better than the big cities)
- The train from Barreiro Terminal (same location as the ferry station) that takes you down to Setubal - which is a great day trip on the weekend.
- Fibre internet everywhere.
- It is a vibrant area with many families with kids etc.

The cons (nothing bad, just observations):
- You cannot swim in the water, it is not that clean. I have seen people do it and you could, it probably won't be very refreshing though and you may have a slight smell afterwards.
- Some parts of Barreiro look pretty run down from the street (google maps will be a good help here). The areas along the water generally have the nicer looking / feeling apartments / streets.
- I doubt you will find a place with a garden to rent - its mainly apartment blocks here.
- Getting to Almada / Costa da Caparica from Barreiro is a long 20 euro+ Uber drive. It's possible via the train. Barreiro -> Pinhal Novo -> Pragal (Almada) - but that can take up to 2 hours as its a bit of a trip.

Other:
If you enjoy the "flashy things" in Lisbon or if you want to spend most of your time there and you don't like relying on public transport and taking time out of your day to get to there, Barreiro is not for you. If you are more budget conscious or want a more authentic and out of the way location that is still close to Lisbon, at up to half the price, then its a good option.

Overall I would recommend it as a starter base - but maybe not for the long term - its very subjective. It all depends on what you have planned and your preferences. But its great value and has all the modern conveniences you would expect 🙂

There are plenty of rental agents around.

Let me know if you have any questions.

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(@kelsteph)
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@andrew_za Very informative!  Thank you for posting this info.

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 KOM
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(@kom)
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@andrew_za This is a very informative post. We are considering buying in the centro históric of Barreiro, moving from Caldas da Rainha. 
I understand Barreiro still has a stigma attached to it (as do many areas on the south bank), but can you comment on the area's safety? For example, petty crime, did you feel safe walking about at night? Would you walk from the ferry at night to the center?

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(@andrew_za)
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@kom We are still here in the same area, we are positioned closer to the water, and as such, walking at night feels safe as there is a lot of light and open space around us. I would consider us to be located in the better part of the larger area. We sometimes walk from the Continente back home with groceries at around 10 pm and it feels safe. However, walking from the Ferry into the central area may be different. I can't speak from experience. In general, I would not be out walking after the ferry / public transport closes or the daily 'buzz' dies down after 11 pm.

Negatives and anecdotal (nitpicking):
- After speaking with a local barber I was advised to avoid groups of young men late at night who may cause issues, especially if I was a foreigner.
- I have heard what I believe to be gunshots in 3-4 instances (mainly around 10-12pm) over the last 1.75 years.
- My bank manager once told me her apartment was broken into.

I would not think that the safety here is any different from living in Lisbon from what I have heard and felt. We have definitely felt safe and comfortable. Provided you are not alone very late at night and follow common sense measures - you will be comfortable. If you are planning on walking at night after 10pm/11pm like one might do more so in Lisbon, that may be riskier due to there being fewer people out, but I don't have enough experience to comment definitively.

Caldas da Rainha would have a much different feeling - so I would advise perhaps staying here for a week - doing a bit of late-night walking etc to get a feel before buying, if you have not done so already.

If you have any other questions - feel free!

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(@andrew_za)
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@kom Unrelated to safety two other observations about the area, of recent.

1) There is a massive lifestyle luxury apartment complex going up next to the Continente - right in front of the water. T4 penthouse suites going for 1.25 mil. Check it out at nooba.pt - this will definitely elevate the area and is an early sign of serious private capital deployment in the area.

2) My Portuguese teacher informed me that historically, the South Bank areas (Almada, Seixal and Barreiro) have the largest Communist Party support in the country. I found that interesting.

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(@antonio_f)
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@andrew_za Regarding 2), the Portuguese Comunist Party had the most support in that area (because of the factory workers) and in the Alentejo region (agricultural workers), but that support is fadding, with the old supporters dying and less new ones joinning.

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(@andrew_za)
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@antonio_f Thanks for that insight/good to know - I can imagine that being the case. She mentioned the Alentejo as well - coming to think about it.

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 KOM
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(@kom)
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@andrew_za Thank you so much for your candid reply. We are looking very close to the Mercado Municipal 1º de Maio. It would be rare for us to be out after 11 but I understand your point on common sense late at night. 

I have been looking at the Nooba development you are talking about - has it started yet or are they still in the selling phase? This is in a different area to the Baía Residence?

Interestingly, I also read about the Communist Party leaning in the area which I imagine is due to its working-class industrial past. Although I believe the socialist party has been in for some time. 

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(@andrew_za)
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@kom Any time. The area near the Mercado Municipal is quite a good area in my opinion. Definitely in the heart of the center and close to the ferry.

The nooba development has started - they are busy with the foundation/ground prep at the moment. They have a dedicated sales office on site too.

If you are referring to this, yes different areas but still close. 
https://www.venda-direta.pt/empreendimento/baia-residence-barreiro/19792125 - This seems to be well located, close to the Mercado Municipal.

Nooba is here, next to the water / Continente: https://goo.gl/maps/CW4t3feDhG1KaDf27.

Yes, PS runs the Camara. They do a good job. Lots of new/improved social areas etc.

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Community Member
(@andrew_za)
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@kom I walked past that Baia development a few months back and it looked abandoned. Not sure of the status now.

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(@jonesdn2020)
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Something to consider is where the new airport will actually be developed. They initially slated Montijo but nothing seems to be certain yet. We had lived next to LAX at one point and will not make that mistake again. 

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(@thomasribatejo)
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Here's a location map of the two main Lisbon-adjacent scenarios - it would not be both of these locations.  Alcochete could be a complete replacement for the current airport; Montijo would be too small, and would work in tandem with the current airport.

Another recent, serious contender is a zone slightly north of Santarém.  There are other, less serious, wildcards - and some still hold out hope of the "white elephant" airport of Beja being used (as it was configured for passenger use, but never came into meaningful operation, being too far from Lisbon or the Algarve).

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(@jonesdn2020)
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@thomasribatejo It is the flight paths that would concern me. We live almost directly below the Lisbon airport but are just about completely out of the flight paths.

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(@antonio_f)
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@jonesdn2020 The new Lisbon airport is a OLD discussion, like 50 year old or so (1969, to be exact, when they started to think of an alternative), and is not going to be defined soon.

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